Do you believe Bin Laden was killed in the Navy Seal raid and dumped in the ocean? If so, why?

[shiva2999]

4 hours ago, jc856 said:

I’m curious.

Do you remember a few years back when a moon landing denier got in Buzz Aldrins face saying he was a liar and fake,  and Aldrin punched him in the mouth?

I was wondering if you would tell the dude who killed bin fuckin (Robert O’Neill) that you believe he is a liar?

I mean, to his face. That is pretty insulting, it’s almost like you are accusing him of “stolen valor”, if he is living this hero lie.

or, was he not in on it?

Huh?

WTF does this have to do with anything?

The FACT IS there is ZERO EVIDENCE of the truth of their claim when it would have been easy to provide it.

If you want to buy their excuse they didn't want to offend delicate Muslim sensibilities then that's up to you, just as long as you're willing to admit it's pure conjecture with nothing to verify it.

[shiva2999]

2 hours ago, Herodotus said:

A paid operative of the CIA who got too independent minded

Bin Laden had no need to get paid. Money was not an issue.

[HipKat]

This is actually a good question. I think he might have been killed, although it’s also possible he had already been dead, and they just needed a story to justify the raid.

Most likely he was killed in the raid. I don’t really believe they dumped his body in the ocean just like that. I’m more inclined to believe that they still have his body somewhere. Or that after they were done collecting all the DNA they could, and probably examining his brain, for whatever the fuck they examine greens for, he was quietly cremated. 

[SackMan518]

My take, Bin Laden was a manufactured boogyman by the Intelligence Agencies to justify their "War on Terror" which basically ran interference for Israel power in the Middle East. I seriously doubt some jabroni in a cave in Afghanistan masterminded the attack on the Twin Towers on 9/11 especially since it was known that the guy needed a dialysis machine which I don't believe they have readily available out in the mountains.

My guess is that the guy actually died of health complications around 2001 and since then it was all a staged show to make the public think he was still out there on the lam. The same thing with the raid. With all of the modern technology we have there was no footage of the raid showing his capture or even a death photo of the man purported to have cause so much chaos and murder? Finally, I've never heard of such a thing as a burial at sea for the "world's top terrorist" making it impossible to verify that the corpse was his. If that didn't perk up your bullshit sensors you're as gullible as they come.

If you want a Hollywood parallel to the fake Bin Laden story check out Ben Kingsley's portrayal of "The Mandarin" in Iron Man 3.

[shiva2999]

Does everyone here know, for example, that the famous picture of the whole braintrust supposedly watching the raid "as it happened" was a complete fabrication?

They were just ACTING.

[jamsim67]

9 hours ago, Herodotus said:

A paid operative of the CIA who got too independent minded

Not saying that's not true, but where did you get that story?

[HipKat]

2 hours ago, SackMan518 said:

My take, Bin Laden was a manufactured boogyman by the Intelligence Agencies to justify their "War on Terror" which basically ran interference for Israel power in the Middle East. I seriously doubt some jabroni in a cave in Afghanistan masterminded the attack on the Twin Towers on 9/11 especially since it was known that the guy needed a dialysis machine which I don't believe they have readily available out in the mountains.

My guess is that the guy actually died of health complications around 2001 and since then it was all a staged show to make the public think he was still out there on the lam. The same thing with the raid. With all of the modern technology we have there was no footage of the raid showing his capture or even a death photo of the man purported to have cause so much chaos and murder? Finally, I've never heard of such a thing as a burial at sea for the "world's top terrorist" making it impossible to verify that the corpse was his. If that didn't perk up your bullshit sensors you're as gullible as they come.

If you want a Hollywood parallel to the fake Bin Laden story check out Ben Kingsley's portrayal of "The Mandarin" in Iron Man 3.

How could he have died of health complications in 2001 when he was making videos well after the fact? Why is it that everything has to be a fucking conspiracy with you? Have you ever thought about maybe a little counseling or something?

[jamsim67]

2 hours ago, shiva2999 said:

Does everyone here know, for example, that the famous picture of the whole braintrust supposedly watching the raid "as it happened" was a complete fabrication?

They were just ACTING.

Almost everything is fabrication. "wag the dog"

[HipKat]

4 minutes ago, jamsim67 said:

Almost everything is fabrication. "wag the dog"

I don’t understand how you conspiracy theorists manage to stay alive. I mean everybody’s out to get here. We’re in the matrix. Nothing is real. Why don’t you guys just fucking kill yourselves and get it over with then you’ll be free.

[Herodotus]

56 minutes ago, jamsim67 said:

Not saying that's not true, but where did you get that story?

https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna3340101

[jamsim67]

7 minutes ago, HipKat said:

I don’t understand how you conspiracy theorists manage to stay alive. I mean everybody’s out to get here. We’re in the matrix. Nothing is real. Why don’t you guys just fucking kill yourselves and get it over with then you’ll be free.

Of course you don't understand. It's called not always accepting the official narrative, and looking for more information on the subject. I get it, you're a busy guy. It's easier to just accept the official story and move on. And that's not a knock. A lot of people are not interested. 

However, I do think it's laughable that anytime anybody disagrees with you they suddenly become a conspiracy theorist, or a MAGA, or any other name that someone else came up with that you (or others, to be fair) can regurgitate in a second, thinking it somehow validates your argument. It doesn't. There's a ton of information at our fingertips, some good and some bad. And it's up to us, or not (in your case, and others) to research, decipher and decide if you believe it or not. And you should always be on the lookout for disinformation, just waiting to throw us off the trail. You have the right to believe, or not believe, it's entirely up to you.

[jamsim67]

40 minutes ago, Herodotus said:

https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna3340101

At this point, we believe, what we believe. Lot's of stories. And that's it, stories.

[SackMan518]

1 hour ago, HipKat said:

How could he have died of health complications in 2001 when he was making videos well after the fact?

Dear Lord, why are you so goddamn so gullible? Out of 8 Billion people on the planet you don't think it's well within the realm of possibility to find more than a few guys who bear a striking resemblance to keep the terrorism Golden Goose going? Why did we suddenly stop getting videos and only audio recordings?

Swiss scientists 95% sure that Bin Laden recording was fake (2002)

 

Scientists in Switzerland say they are almost certain that a recent audio tape attributed to Osama bin Laden is a fake.

The tape, delivered to the Arab satellite television channel al-Jazeera earlier this month, appeared to provide the first concrete evidence that Bin Laden is still alive because it mentioned recent attacks on western targets.

American experts initially concluded that the voice on the tape was probably Bin Laden, though it is unlikely ever to be fully authenticated because of the recording's poor quality.

The Swiss findings conflict with other research published by the French news magazine L'Express last week.

In that study, Bernard Gautheron, director of the phonetic testing laboratory at the Institute of Linguistics and Phonetics in Paris, concluded there was a "very strong probability" that the al-Jazeera tape was genuine.

But researchers at the Dalle Molle Institute for Perceptual Artificial Intelligence, in Lausanne, believe the message was recorded by an impostor.

In a study commissioned by France 2 television, researchers built a computer model of Bin Laden's voice, based on an hour of genuine recordings.

Using voice recognition systems being developed for banking security, they tested the model against 20 known recordings of Bin Laden. The system correctly identified his voice in 19 of them.

This meant there was only a 5% risk of error in their conclusion that the latest tape is a fake, Professor Hervé Bourlard, the institute's director, told the Guardian yesterday. "It's an automatic system but it's very sensitive," he said. "It picks up things the human ear doesn't pick up."

He agreed that the sound quality of the recent tape was poor but added: "Many of our 20 [test] recordings were also of poor quality. Some were very good, some very bad, but our results were all positive except in one case."

Prof Bourlard, a voice recognition expert, is the author or joint author of 150 research papers and two books, and has worked extensively with the International Computer Science Institute at Berkeley, California.

CIA's secret Iraq weapon revealed: a Saddam gay sex tape
Bizarre US plots included exploding cigars to kill Fidel Castro and fake video of Osama bin Laden's campfire drinking

 

But that did not stop a CIA video being shot of a fake Osama bin Laden sitting around a camp fire, drinking booze and boasting of his own gay conquests.

The video apparently used some of the CIA's "darker skinned" employees as extras playing the terror chief's henchmen. It does not seem to have been released.

The Post said an anonymous US official had declined to confirm or deny the accounts. "If these ideas were ever floated by anyone at any time, they clearly didn't go anywhere," the official said.

Such tactics are hardly the first time the US agencies have stretched their imaginations. A book entitled 638 Ways to Kill Castro detailed the many ways the Cuban leader had been targeted over the decades.

One of the lesser known was a plan to dispatch Castro by exploiting his fascination for scuba-diving. A batch of colourful molluscs would be rigged with explosives in the hope that he would be attracted to them while swimming underwater.

 

1 hour ago, HipKat said:

Why is it that everything has to be a fucking conspiracy with you?

The correct question is asking why you trust the government and intelligence agencies so much.

1 hour ago, HipKat said:

Have you ever thought about maybe a little counseling or something?

I have but it's only to help me get over the fact that most of the world's population are so fucking stupid.

 

[shiva2999]

23 minutes ago, jamsim67 said:

At this point, we believe, what we believe. Lot's of stories. And that's it, stories.

That particular "story" starts with the assumption that bin Laden was actually involved rather than just playing a part.

[jamsim67]

11 minutes ago, shiva2999 said:

That particular "story" starts with the assumption that bin Laden was actually involved rather than just playing a part.

That's true, but I'm sure if we looked hard enough, we'd find lots of particular stories.

[HipKat]

54 minutes ago, jamsim67 said:

Of course you don't understand. It's called not always accepting the official narrative, and looking for more information on the subject. I get it, you're a busy guy. It's easier to just accept the official story and move on. And that's not a knock. A lot of people are not interested. 

However, I do think it's laughable that anytime anybody disagrees with you they suddenly become a conspiracy theorist, or a MAGA, or any other name that someone else came up with that you (or others, to be fair) can regurgitate in a second, thinking it somehow validates your argument. It doesn't. There's a ton of information at our fingertips, some good and some bad. And it's up to us, or not (in your case, and others) to research, decipher and decide if you believe it or not. And you should always be on the lookout for disinformation, just waiting to throw us off the trail. You have the right to believe, or not believe, it's entirely up to you.

Dude, the exact inverse of not always accepting it is never accepting it. People with common sense stay somewhere in the middle. You fuckers think the sun rising in the morning is a conspiracy.

[jamsim67]

Just now, HipKat said:

Dude, the exact inverse of not always accepting. It is never accepting it. People with common sense stay somewhere in the middle. You fuckers think the sun rising in the morning is a conspiracy.

Besides the transgender debate, when have you ever been somewhere in the middle? Those with common sense ask questions (like why?, or how?), those without common sense call those who ask questions conspiracy theorists. Because at the end of the day, that's all you have. Asking questions, and looking for answers is called research. Calling someone a conspiracy theorist is lazy, and does nothing to bolster your argument.

 

[HipKat]

39 minutes ago, jamsim67 said:

Besides the transgender debate, when have you ever been somewhere in the middle? Those with common sense ask questions (like why?, or how?), those without common sense call those who ask questions conspiracy theorists. Because at the end of the day, that's all you have. Asking questions, and looking for answers is called research. Calling someone a conspiracy theorist is lazy, and does nothing to bolster your argument.

 

Asking questions is one thing and yeah, people should ask questions and you’re not as bad as some of the other people on here, but to them, they think they already have the answers, and the answers are always nefarious. You’re going to tell me that makes sense?

[Philly'sFinest]

3 hours ago, HipKat said:

I don’t understand how you conspiracy theorists manage to stay alive. I mean everybody’s out to get here. We’re in the matrix. Nothing is real. Why don’t you guys just fucking kill yourselves and get it over with then you’ll be free.

We are much more free than you, because we are awake to all the lies and manipulation that has been perpetrated upon the people.

You are a mental slave to a system that mocks you and your inability to think for yourself. They love that you comply without questioning a thing. 

You live a lie because it makes you feel better. 

I feel better knowing the ugly truths of the world

We are not the same

[jc856]

6 hours ago, shiva2999 said:

Does everyone here know, for example, that the famous picture of the whole braintrust supposedly watching the raid "as it happened" was a complete fabrication?

They were just ACTING.

Do tell.

[ICRockets2]

6 minutes ago, Philly'sFinest said:

 

You live a lie because it makes you feel better. 

I feel better knowing the ugly truths of the world

 

Oh sweetie

[shiva2999]

29 minutes ago, jc856 said:

Do tell.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8493391/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Blackout-during-raid-on-bin-Laden-compound.html

 

Osama bin Laden dead: Blackout during raid on bin Laden compound

The head of the CIA admitted yesterday that there was no live video footage of the raid on Osama bin Laden's compound as further doubts emerged about the US version of events.

By Steven Swinford04 May 2011 • 10:25pm

Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, revealed there was a 25 minute blackout during which the live feed from cameras mounted on the helmets of the US special forces was cut off.

A photograph released by the White House appeared to show President Barack Obama and his aides in the situation room watching the action as it unfolded. In fact they had little knowledge of what was happening in the compound.

In an interview with PBS, Mr Panetta said: "Once those teams went into the compound I can tell you that there was a time period of almost 20 or 25 minutes where we really didn't know just exactly what was going on. And there were some very tense moments as we were waiting for information.

"We had some observation of the approach there, but we did not have direct flow of information as to the actual conduct of the operation itself as they were going through the compound."

Mr Panetta also told the network that the US Navy Seals, rather than Mr Obama, made the final decision to kill bin Laden.

He said: "The authority here was to kill bin Laden. And obviously, under the rules of engagement, if he had in fact thrown up his hands, surrendered and didn't appear to be representing any kind of threat, then they were to capture him. But they had full authority to kill him.

"To be frank, I don't think he had a lot of time to say anything. It was a firefight going up that compound. And by the time they got to the third floor and found bin Laden, I think it - this was all split-second action on the part of the Seals."

The President only knew the mission was successful after the Navy Seals commander heard the word “Geronimo” on the radio, a code word from commandos reporting that they had killed bin Laden.

The absence of footage of the raid has led to conflicting reports about what happened in the compound. According to Pakistani authorities one of bin Laden’s daughter’s, who was present during the raid, claimed that her father was captured alive before he was killed.

There was also growing doubt about the US claims that Pakistan’s intelligence agencies involved in the raid.

Lieutenant General Asad Durrani, former head of the ISI, Pakistan's intelligence service, said it was "inconceivable" that his government was unaware of the US raid on Osama bin Laden's compound.

He claimed his country was forced to deny any knowledge of the raid to avoid a domestic backlash. The ISI's official line has been that bin Laden's compound had "slipped off our radar" after it raided the building in 2003 while hunting for another senior al-Qaeda operative.The agency claims it was unaware that bin Laden was hiding there.

Lieutenant General Durrani, however, said that the denial was a "political" maneuver by the intelligence services to avoid claims that they were working too closely with the US.

He said: "It is more likely that they did know [about the raid]. It is not conceivable that it was done without the involvement of Pakistani security forces at some stage. They were involved and they were told they were in position.

"The army chief was in his office, the cordons had been thrown around that particular place. The Pakistani helicopters were also in the air so that indicates that it was involved.

"[There are] political implications back home. If you say that you are involved there is a large, vocal faction of Pakistani society that will get very upset because we are carrying out repeatedly these operations with the Americans."

 

[ICRockets2]

16 minutes ago, shiva2999 said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8493391/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Blackout-during-raid-on-bin-Laden-compound.html

 

Osama bin Laden dead: Blackout during raid on bin Laden compound

The head of the CIA admitted yesterday that there was no live video footage of the raid on Osama bin Laden's compound as further doubts emerged about the US version of events.

By Steven Swinford04 May 2011 • 10:25pm

Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, revealed there was a 25 minute blackout during which the live feed from cameras mounted on the helmets of the US special forces was cut off.

A photograph released by the White House appeared to show President Barack Obama and his aides in the situation room watching the action as it unfolded. In fact they had little knowledge of what was happening in the compound.

In an interview with PBS, Mr Panetta said: "Once those teams went into the compound I can tell you that there was a time period of almost 20 or 25 minutes where we really didn't know just exactly what was going on. And there were some very tense moments as we were waiting for information.

"We had some observation of the approach there, but we did not have direct flow of information as to the actual conduct of the operation itself as they were going through the compound."

Mr Panetta also told the network that the US Navy Seals, rather than Mr Obama, made the final decision to kill bin Laden.

He said: "The authority here was to kill bin Laden. And obviously, under the rules of engagement, if he had in fact thrown up his hands, surrendered and didn't appear to be representing any kind of threat, then they were to capture him. But they had full authority to kill him.

"To be frank, I don't think he had a lot of time to say anything. It was a firefight going up that compound. And by the time they got to the third floor and found bin Laden, I think it - this was all split-second action on the part of the Seals."

The President only knew the mission was successful after the Navy Seals commander heard the word “Geronimo” on the radio, a code word from commandos reporting that they had killed bin Laden.

The absence of footage of the raid has led to conflicting reports about what happened in the compound. According to Pakistani authorities one of bin Laden’s daughter’s, who was present during the raid, claimed that her father was captured alive before he was killed.

There was also growing doubt about the US claims that Pakistan’s intelligence agencies involved in the raid.

Lieutenant General Asad Durrani, former head of the ISI, Pakistan's intelligence service, said it was "inconceivable" that his government was unaware of the US raid on Osama bin Laden's compound.

He claimed his country was forced to deny any knowledge of the raid to avoid a domestic backlash. The ISI's official line has been that bin Laden's compound had "slipped off our radar" after it raided the building in 2003 while hunting for another senior al-Qaeda operative.The agency claims it was unaware that bin Laden was hiding there.

Lieutenant General Durrani, however, said that the denial was a "political" maneuver by the intelligence services to avoid claims that they were working too closely with the US.

He said: "It is more likely that they did know [about the raid]. It is not conceivable that it was done without the involvement of Pakistani security forces at some stage. They were involved and they were told they were in position.

"The army chief was in his office, the cordons had been thrown around that particular place. The Pakistani helicopters were also in the air so that indicates that it was involved.

"[There are] political implications back home. If you say that you are involved there is a large, vocal faction of Pakistani society that will get very upset because we are carrying out repeatedly these operations with the Americans."

 

Nothing in this article calls into question the legitimacy of the photo.

[jc856]

25 minutes ago, shiva2999 said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/al-qaeda/8493391/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Blackout-during-raid-on-bin-Laden-compound.html

 

Osama bin Laden dead: Blackout during raid on bin Laden compound

The head of the CIA admitted yesterday that there was no live video footage of the raid on Osama bin Laden's compound as further doubts emerged about the US version of events.

By Steven Swinford04 May 2011 • 10:25pm

Leon Panetta, director of the CIA, revealed there was a 25 minute blackout during which the live feed from cameras mounted on the helmets of the US special forces was cut off.

A photograph released by the White House appeared to show President Barack Obama and his aides in the situation room watching the action as it unfolded. In fact they had little knowledge of what was happening in the compound.

In an interview with PBS, Mr Panetta said: "Once those teams went into the compound I can tell you that there was a time period of almost 20 or 25 minutes where we really didn't know just exactly what was going on. And there were some very tense moments as we were waiting for information.

"We had some observation of the approach there, but we did not have direct flow of information as to the actual conduct of the operation itself as they were going through the compound."

Mr Panetta also told the network that the US Navy Seals, rather than Mr Obama, made the final decision to kill bin Laden.

He said: "The authority here was to kill bin Laden. And obviously, under the rules of engagement, if he had in fact thrown up his hands, surrendered and didn't appear to be representing any kind of threat, then they were to capture him. But they had full authority to kill him.

"To be frank, I don't think he had a lot of time to say anything. It was a firefight going up that compound. And by the time they got to the third floor and found bin Laden, I think it - this was all split-second action on the part of the Seals."

The President only knew the mission was successful after the Navy Seals commander heard the word “Geronimo” on the radio, a code word from commandos reporting that they had killed bin Laden.

The absence of footage of the raid has led to conflicting reports about what happened in the compound. According to Pakistani authorities one of bin Laden’s daughter’s, who was present during the raid, claimed that her father was captured alive before he was killed.

There was also growing doubt about the US claims that Pakistan’s intelligence agencies involved in the raid.

Lieutenant General Asad Durrani, former head of the ISI, Pakistan's intelligence service, said it was "inconceivable" that his government was unaware of the US raid on Osama bin Laden's compound.

He claimed his country was forced to deny any knowledge of the raid to avoid a domestic backlash. The ISI's official line has been that bin Laden's compound had "slipped off our radar" after it raided the building in 2003 while hunting for another senior al-Qaeda operative.The agency claims it was unaware that bin Laden was hiding there.

Lieutenant General Durrani, however, said that the denial was a "political" maneuver by the intelligence services to avoid claims that they were working too closely with the US.

He said: "It is more likely that they did know [about the raid]. It is not conceivable that it was done without the involvement of Pakistani security forces at some stage. They were involved and they were told they were in position.

"The army chief was in his office, the cordons had been thrown around that particular place. The Pakistani helicopters were also in the air so that indicates that it was involved.

"[There are] political implications back home. If you say that you are involved there is a large, vocal faction of Pakistani society that will get very upset because we are carrying out repeatedly these operations with the Americans."

 

Kind of a gray area to me.

they were looking at video of something, even though during the raid, the cameras were turned off. Seems suspicious that it wasn’t filmed, I grant you. 

But I mean, the photog wasn’t directing their pose, was he?

 

 

[jc856]

1 hour ago, ICRockets2 said:

Oh sweetie

Stop those micro-aggressions, you know us virile males get nervous when someone with a penis* call us sweetie or honey.🤣🤣

* very slightly used..

only my wife gets to call me honey. Anyone else, they’re fightin’ wurdz.