"Nice of FLOTUS to encourage the diminishment of women on ‘international women's day.’

[ICRockets2]

3 minutes ago, LiterateStylish said:

Semantics won't help you. Sex is directly intertwined with Trans. Even Trans movements have given up the fight you can't stop waging because you are unable to control your emotions.

I already told you, there are both physiological and social elements to transitioning.  Nobody is denying that.  It doesn't mean sex and gender are no longer distinct categories.

[ICRockets2]

7 minutes ago, LiterateStylish said:

Uhm, what?

Do you have any clue what you just wrote?

https://open.lib.umn.edu/evolutionbiology/chapter/7-4-sex-its-about-the-gametes-2/

[LiterateStylish]

19 minutes ago, ICRockets2 said:

Yes.  

You clearly don't.

Gametes ARE chromosomes. They're a set of 23 chromosomes (the sperm/egg). It's like saying snow isn't water.

I'm pretty sure you just quickly google these topics and hope you gather enough information to sound right. But you're not. Rarely ever in fact.

I *think* what you probably randomly stumbled upon within google is the fact that gamete size can also serve to determine sex because XY containing gamets are smaller than XX containing gamets.

What you didn't realize, since you don't know what you're talking about, is that it's the SAME thing. The sex chromosomes within the gamet is what gives it its size. XX and XY determine sex regardless. 

 

[LiterateStylish]

7 minutes ago, ICRockets2 said:

https://open.lib.umn.edu/evolutionbiology/chapter/7-4-sex-its-about-the-gametes-2/

Knew it! He just randomly googles and hopes he understands the topic in a quick scanning. But he doesn't understand what the words are actually telling him!

[ICRockets2]

None of what you just vomited out makes me wrong.  If you said biologists use chromosomes to determine sex, you'd be wrong.

[LiterateStylish]

6 minutes ago, ICRockets2 said:

  If you said biologists use chromosomes to determine sex, you'd be wrong.

You already said they determine sex by gametes (which is not true linguistically). Except gametes ARE chromosomes. They are literally the XX or XY. Its the same thing.

So what is it?

[LiterateStylish]

Sex Determinations

 doi: 10.1371/journal.pbio.100189

PMCID: PMC4077654

In humans, sex is determined by sex chromosomes (XX females, XY males). The X and Y chromosomes harbor dramatically different numbers and sets of genes (about 1,000 genes on the X and only a few dozen genes on the Y), yet they originated from ordinary autosomes during the early evolution of mammals (Figure 1).

 

 

[ICRockets2]

6 minutes ago, LiterateStylish said:

Sex Determinations

 doi: 10.1371/journal.pbio.100189

PMCID: PMC4077654

In humans, sex is determined by sex chromosomes (XX females, XY males). The X and Y chromosomes harbor dramatically different numbers and sets of genes (about 1,000 genes on the X and only a few dozen genes on the Y), yet they originated from ordinary autosomes during the early evolution of mammals (Figure 1).

 

 

That's from 2014, the link I provided is from a 2020 textbook.  I'm gonna go by the more recent one.

[LiterateStylish]

4 minutes ago, ICRockets2 said:

That's from 2014, the link I provided is from a 2020 textbook.  I'm gonna go by the more recent one.

YOUR link confirms what I said lol. You just don't have the knowledge to understand that.

Gamete ARE the chromosomes. The XX or XY is what determines the size of the gamete.

Therefore, in humans, we use XX and XY to determine sex. However, not all species have an XX or XY. So across species, we use gamete size since its the same thing and we don't have to break down chromosomes.

Thus why your link says  "The one feature that you can use across species to distinguish males from females is gamete size"

But even applied to humans, it doesnt matter. It's still XX and XY which determine the size of the gamete.

[LiterateStylish]

I never thought i'd actually have a debate as ridiculous as "is snow water" like this one lol

 

[ICRockets2]

3 minutes ago, LiterateStylish said:

I never thought i'd actually have a debate as ridiculous as "is snow water" like this one lol

I thought you didn't insult people

[LiterateStylish]

Just now, ICRockets2 said:

I thought you didn't insult people

Where is the insult? Saying your shocked youre having a conversation isn't an insult.

[LiterateStylish]

I realize i'm beating a completely beaten and demoralized horse at this point, but...

Here is a source from March of 2023. Literally this month. Source: National Human Genome Project. Probably the best source you could have on this topic.

 

"...two sex chromosomes that are involved in sex determination. Females have two X chromosomes in their cells, while males have one X and one Y."

https://www.genome.gov/genetics-glossary/Sex-Chromosome

 

[ICRockets2]

Just now, LiterateStylish said:

Where is the insult? Saying your shocked youre having a conversation isn't an insult.

Everything you're saying is insulting.  You could just have this conversation without the snark and the snide comments, but you're choosing to make them because you INTEND to be insulting.

And I have no problem with you being insulting.  I have a problem with you pretending to be above doing so when you demonstrably are not.

[LiterateStylish]

2 minutes ago, ICRockets2 said:

Everything you're saying is insulting.  You could just have this conversation without the snark and the snide comments, but you're choosing to make them because you INTEND to be insulting.

And I have no problem with you being insulting.  I have a problem with you pretending to be above doing so when you demonstrably are not.

There is no snark on my side.

Disbelief? Yes.

Disbelief that someone like you can be so pompous as to always think they're right when they have very little understanding on the topic.

It's what your generation does though. They have replaced true knowledge with quick google searches where they scan a page and *think* they know what it means, but oftentimes do not.

[ICRockets2]

Just now, LiterateStylish said:

There is no snark on my side.

Disbelief? Yes.

Disbelief that someone can be so pompous as to always think they're right when they have very little understanding on the topic.

It's what your generation does though. They have replaced true knowledge with quick google searches where they scan a page and *think* they know what it means, but oftentimes do not.

This is, yet again, insulting.  Feel free to keep doing it, but until you acknowledge that you are I'm going to keep calling you on it.  In fact, that is the extent of the conversation you will get out of me until you rescind the transparent dumbfuckery of "I don't insult people"

[LiterateStylish]

Just now, ICRockets2 said:

This is, yet again, insulting.  Feel free to keep doing it, but until you acknowledge that you are I'm going to keep calling you on it.  In fact, that is the extent of the conversation you will get out of me until you rescind the transparent dumbfuckery of "I don't insult people"

You can be insulted by it, but that doesnt make it insulting from this POV.

[ICRockets2]

Just now, LiterateStylish said:

You can be insulted by it, but that doesnt make it insulting from this POV.

Then when I call you retarded it isn't slander.  

[LiterateStylish]

Honest question. And I know i've asked before but you always ignore the question. Do you ever get to a topic that isnt in your wheelhouse, so you be a grown up and say to yourself "I dont really know what the fuck im talking about in this particular conversation so let me shut the fuck up"?

Have you ever had that thought before?

It's one of the most valuable lessons I learned in my life. I suggest everyone learn it.

[LiterateStylish]

1 minute ago, ICRockets2 said:

Then when I call you retarded it isn't slander.  

That's objectively slander. 

Back to the topic though: Would it be okay to change "woman" to XX (or L-gamete if you prefer) and men to XY (or S-gamete if you prefer)? 

Label the bathrooms the same?

[ICRockets2]

Just now, LiterateStylish said:

Honest question. And I know i've asked before but you always ignore the question. DO you ever get to a topic that isnt in your wheelhouse, so you be a grown up and say to yourself "I dont really know what the fuck im talking about in this particular conversation so let me shut the fuck up"?

It's one of the most valuable lessons I learned in my life. I suggest everyone learn it.

If you had actually learned that lesson you wouldn't say anything on trans issues.

As far as I know, there haven't been topics yet discussed on this forum that I feel I need to avoid discussing out of a concern for a lack of depth to my knowledge.  Everyone here is stupider than I am, so I'm confident I can learn enough either prior to engaging or via the act of engaging to hold my own.  

I enjoy learning, so if you're right and I'm wrong that's great.  You may be right about human sex identification, but you continue to be wrong about literally everything related to trans people so enjoy your incredibly narrow slice of education you've provided. 

Maybe sometime you can try learning too!  It's fun!

[ICRockets2]

4 minutes ago, LiterateStylish said:

That's objectively slander. 

Back to the topic though: Would it be okay to change "woman" to XX (or L-gamete if you prefer) and men to XY (or S-gamete if you prefer)? 

Label the bathrooms the same?

No, because then trans women are still forced into "XY/Sg" spaces where they are provably at risk for physical and sexual assault.

[LiterateStylish]

24 minutes ago, ICRockets2 said:

No, because then trans women are still forced into "XY/Sg" spaces where they are provably at risk for physical and sexual assault.

So we are back to safety being the issue?

[ICRockets2]

6 minutes ago, LiterateStylish said:

So we are back to safety being the issue?

That's always been the issue.  The only reason I've bothered with other arguments is because of your virulent anti-empiricism.

[Angry Byrds]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwiohIW4zdT9AhVyTDABHeDQA9MQtwJ6BAg9EAI&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DURz-RYEOaig&usg=AOvVaw3bh_AEAHb7X9Vxs0BGNtJN