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Crazy Legs

Bills must keep TE Charles Clay until 2019. So sell me on OJ Howard for the 10th pick

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According to spotrac, Charles Clay would have huge Dead Cap implications if he were cut or released before 2019. So figure he is here for 2017 and 2018.

 

And he will receive $9 million in 2017 and $9 million in 2018 in salary. Not a guy you keep on the bench. You play him.

 

Given Tyrod Taylor is not Drew Brees i.e. 5000 yards a year passing, how do you see OJ Howard being worth the 10th pick on the Bills?

 

Assuming Clay's production stays about the same, Charles Clay had 51 catches in 2015 + 3 TDs and 57 catches + 4 TDs in 2016, how many balls would OJ Howard have come his way?

 

OJ Howard is a dynamic player, but is he a good fit for the 2017 Buffalo Bills?

TE Eric Ebron had 25 catches as a rookie. Would you be happy if Howard had 25 catches after we drafted 10th overall?


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You use him like gronk as a WR. Who covers him?

 

You won't know his full potential til we have a decent Qb though.


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According to spotrac, Charles Clay would have huge Dead Cap implications if he were cut or released before 2019. So figure he is here for 2017 and 2018.

 

And he will receive $9 million in 2017 and $9 million in 2018 in salary. Not a guy you keep on the bench. You play him.

 

Given Tyrod Taylor is not Drew Brees i.e. 5000 yards a year passing, how do you see OJ Howard being worth the 10th pick on the Bills?

 

Assuming Clay's production stays about the same, Charles Clay had 51 catches in 2015 + 3 TDs and 57 catches + 4 TDs in 2016, how many balls would OJ Howard have come his way?

 

OJ Howard is a dynamic player, but is he a good fit for the 2017 Buffalo Bills?

TE Eric Ebron had 25 catches as a rookie. Would you be happy if Howard had 25 catches after we drafted 10th overall?

 

Of course nobody would be happy if he catches 25 balls in his rookie year. Also, nobody would be happy if Clay catches 25 balls this year. But if you draft Howard, his production should take the place of Woods. Howard is a pure pass catcher. If he can block...bonus. Personally, I think Howard is a significantly better prospect than Eric Ebron. I think he compares to the Gronks, Grahams, and Olsens of the world. I'm also a huge fan of a 2 TE offense, especially for a guy like Tyrod Taylor.

 

And I'm not saying we should definitely draft him because this draft appears deep at TE and they may be able to get a comparable player in round 2 or round 3, but here are my questions to you:

 

1. If you'd be okay drafting a WR at 10 (and I don't know if you are), why not a TE who can have the same production?

2. If you look at Howard and see Rob Gronkowski or Jimmy Graham (which some people do), how can you NOT draft him?

 

I get what you're saying about Clay, but I just hate the idea of missing out on a great player because we gave a bad contract to another guy. It's like letting one mistake compound itself and that's bad business.

 

I'm certainly open to taking him although I would completely understand people not liking the pick.

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You use him like gronk as a WR. Who covers him?

 

You won't know his full potential til we have a decent Qb though.

 

Agreed. I see very little difference between him and a WR so if you're okay with a WR then I think you should be okay with Howard. He's bigger AND as fast as Mike Williams who I've heard nobody complain about. Granted, Williams can do some things Howard probably can't in terms of leaping and body control so it's not completely apples to apples.

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Agreed. I see very little difference between him and a WR so if you're okay with a WR then I think you should be okay with Howard. He's bigger AND as fast as Mike Williams who I've heard nobody complain about. Granted, Williams can do some things Howard probably can't in terms of leaping and body control so it's not completely apples to apples.

 

You also have to keep in mind that there is a bigger drop off at TE after RD1 versus WR which is deep well into RD3-4.

 

Could take Howard at 10, best corner in the 2nd and then WR in the 3rd. That would be a much smarter way to play the board.

 

Howard is growing on me but Whaley was gushing over him so for that reason alone I think we don't take him.

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Agreed. I see very little difference between him and a WR so if you're okay with a WR then I think you should be okay with Howard. He's bigger AND as fast as Mike Williams who I've heard nobody complain about. Granted, Williams can do some things Howard probably can't in terms of leaping and body control so it's not completely apples to apples.

 

I'm not a williams fan. He looks like a one trick pony. Doesn't get separation in college, won't get any in the NFL. Davis or Howard in my mind.


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You also have to keep in mind that there is a bigger drop off at TE after RD1 versus WR which is deep well into RD3-4.

 

Could take Howard at 10, best corner in the 2nd and then WR in the 3rd. That would be a much smarter way to play the board.

 

Howard is growing on me but Whaley was gushing over him so for that reason alone I think we don't take him.

 

Got to take an LB somewhere too.


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He fills the need for a WR but also give you mismatches and makes you less predictable. He is also predicted to go somewhere near the Bills pick so there is no reach. Basically they could run a lot of 12 or 22 personnel (2 TE's) with the option to motion Howard out after locking the defense into the personnel you want. Obviously running out of 12 and 22 will also be done. He also adds depth to TE which is a one (average) man show.

 

Bills fans are hyper focused on players who have WR next to their name but the name. But to me, a TE who has WR type of receiving skills who can also block is way better than having a WR. In fact, he can be used as a WR in 4 man sets like NE does with Gronk.

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Got to take an LB somewhere too.

 

There is time for that, don't forget that we dumpster dived for Zach Brown. Sometimes the best stuff is the junk, still have to wait for June 1st cuts.

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I think Howard would be a bit of a luxury pick, but wouldn't hate it.

 

Clay is a damn good TE. Its just a matter of getting him the ball, which seems to be a serious problem.

 

I'd be excited with Howard, but I think there are better ways to go at 10.

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Well if this isn't perfect Bills logic, we have JP Losman, why draft another QB? We have EJ Manual, Why draft another? We have Charles Clay, why pass on a potential HOF talent that plays the same position?

 

Nope, I can't see a reason to pick anybody in the draft, we have a player at every position already.

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There is time for that, don't forget that we dumpster dived for Zach Brown. Sometimes the best stuff is the junk, still have to wait for June 1st cuts.

 

Zach brown and Zo being good productive players was a stroke of luck. Expecting getting lightning to strike again is a little too optimistic. We need at least one rangy cover LB. At least. They aren't exactly fall in off trees.


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I mean I get it if he's the undisputed BPA.

 

It's still a luxury pick. Two tight end offenses are nice. Clay has a lot of H-Back in his game and Howard can play slot/split out.

 

Causes a weird scenario with DiMarco, but you don't pass on a generational talent because you signed a FB.

 

If you pass on him and 3 years from now he's the best TE in the game you look like a prick.

 

I still think this team should do everything in it's lower to trade down and pick up an extra 2nd somehow.

 

There's a lot of guys at 10 they could plug and play in the secondary at 10.


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Of course nobody would be happy if he catches 25 balls in his rookie year. Also, nobody would be happy if Clay catches 25 balls this year. But if you draft Howard, his production should take the place of Woods. Howard is a pure pass catcher. If he can block...bonus. Personally, I think Howard is a significantly better prospect than Eric Ebron. I think he compares to the Gronks, Grahams, and Olsens of the world. I'm also a huge fan of a 2 TE offense, especially for a guy like Tyrod Taylor.

 

And I'm not saying we should definitely draft him because this draft appears deep at TE and they may be able to get a comparable player in round 2 or round 3, but here are my questions to you:

 

1. If you'd be okay drafting a WR at 10 (and I don't know if you are), why not a TE who can have the same production?

2. If you look at Howard and see Rob Gronkowski or Jimmy Graham (which some people do), how can you NOT draft him?

 

I get what you're saying about Clay, but I just hate the idea of missing out on a great player because we gave a bad contract to another guy. It's like letting one mistake compound itself and that's bad business.

 

I'm certainly open to taking him although I would completely understand people not liking the pick.

 

Great points.

 

I guess I am trying to understand how the Bills offense in 2017 will be able to use both Clay and Howard effectively. Especially with Tyrod at QB.

 

Yes Howard appears to be a dynamic "pass catcher". He had 45 catches this past season, which is a lot for a TE in college, although only 3 went for TDs.

 

Also I don't think you can line up OJ Howard as a WR and replace Robert Woods though. Howard will either be inline, or flexed in the slot.

 

As far as OJ Howard being "Gronk", I don't think he is. Gronk is in his own category. When he high points passes over the middle with a guy hanging on him it looks like he can pulled down passes 10 feet in the air. I don't see any highlights of Howard doing that in college. Howard is probably more like Greg Olsen, IMO. Which is not a bad thing. Just a different type of TE than Gronk.

 

Go Bills.


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Good arguments both ways on this thread (great thread btw)--why use a top 10 pick on a big receiver on a run 1st team--why not a pass catching TE that can block vs Why use a top pick on a TE when we already have a one that is also a great blocker--and there are 2 big WR's coming out this year that can win contested balls-one being compared to megatron--WRs like that only appear every 5 yrs or so--with Tyrod I believe Howard would be better--if we are drafting QB 1st round next year like the Josh's (Rosen or Allen)--Rudolph or Falk--Williams or Davis would make sense--let me add to the dilemma--why go offense--ranked top 10 I BILLieve--while defense faltered--my answer would be to give whichever QB we have a better chance to succeed.


Draft wish list:

1-WR Corey Davis Western Michigan--pick 5 Titans

2-S Obi Melifonwu Connecticut--2nd round--pick 56 Raiders

3-CB Cordrea Tankersley Clemson--3rd round--pick 97 Dolphins

5-LB Connor Harris Lindenwood--undrafted--picked up by Jets

5-OL Conor McDermott UCLA--6th round--pick 211 Patriots-claimed off waivers by Bills

6-QB Chad Kelly Ole Miss--Mr irrelevant--Broncos

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Great points.

 

I guess I am trying to understand how the Bills offense in 2017 will be able to use both Clay and Howard effectively. Especially with Tyrod at QB.

 

Yes Howard appears to be a dynamic "pass catcher". He had 45 catches this past season, which is a lot for a TE in college, although only 3 went for TDs.

 

Also I don't think you can line up OJ Howard as a WR and replace Robert Woods though. Howard will either be inline, or flexed in the slot.

 

As far as OJ Howard being "Gronk", I don't think he is. Gronk is in his own category. When he high points passes over the middle with a guy hanging on him it looks like he can pulled down passes 10 feet in the air. I don't see any highlights of Howard doing that in college. Howard is probably more like Greg Olsen, IMO. Which is not a bad thing. Just a different type of TE than Gronk.

 

Go Bills.

 

Fair.

 

I think he is Gronk, though. I think he's Graham or Gronk. He has no production in college b/c he's never played with a QB. That could still hold true if he comes to Buffalo though. But even so, Taylor may only be our QB for one more year. Who knows where they go from there. That's why I'm a BPA guy in the early rounds and a need guy later on in the draft. Gronks best college season was 47 catches for 672 so there's a comparison to be drawn there as well.

 

I just don't see who is covering this guy so long as your OC has half a brain. I absolutely think he can match Woods' numbers of like 50 catches and 600 yards and 3 TDs and I don't mind if it comes from him being in the slot. So I'm not saying he replaces Woods on the field, Holmes would technically do that. But this kid could match his production or better it IMO.

 

If this kid goes to a team with a good QB, look out.

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i just hope hes as intellectually stimulating as gronk


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He may be more like jimmy graham than gronk. Either way...once he proves he can get open in the NFL he is going to demand a double team. They cant double watkins too.


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I think he is probably the best receiver in the draft.....He runs as fast as Williams. I would be happy with Davis or Howard, but Howard I think is going to be a freak like Gronk. He is 6'6 with great hands and really good speed. How do you cover that?

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I think he is probably the best receiver in the draft.....He runs as fast as Williams. I would be happy with Davis or Howard, but Howard I think is going to be a freak like Gronk. He is 6'6 with great hands and really good speed. How do you cover that?

 

Jimmy Graham was awesome in New Orleans with Drew Brees throwing him the ball.

Now in Seattle, different scheme, different QB, different results.

 

I just hope if the Bills draft OJ Howard (at 10) that they use him.


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I don't have a problem with Howard at 10 talent wise. I do have a problem with Howard at 10 because of the way Tyrod uses the middle of the field, where TE's tend to make their money. Unless this new staff can help Tyrod see the middle of the field, any warm body will suffice at TE. No need to waste a top 10 pick on a literal paper weight.


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Bama fan for over 20 years. Guy had 700 yards receiving in a run first offense. Absolute beast, best receiver in this draft hands down. Runs great routes, has great hands and he is a defensive nightmare for opposing teams with his 6 foot 6 inches body. He will be a top 3 TE by 2020 no matter where he goes, MARK THAT DOWN.

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If we can trade down obtain a 4th and draft te Jake Butt who is,almost recovered from an acl and will drop.He is a complete te who runs great routes great hands and a good blocker. We can use Clay wide . Bills will be using two tight ends a fb as,we are going to be,a running team due to a lack of a qb.

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Jimmy Graham was awesome in New Orleans with Drew Brees throwing him the ball.

Now in Seattle, different scheme, different QB, different results.

 

I just hope if the Bills draft OJ Howard (at 10) that they use him.

 

Graham still puts up big games and the last few years has been brought down by injuries a lot like Gronk has.

 

I see nothing wrong with wanting to use a lot of 2 TE sets.

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